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Thread: Catholicism & Catholics - What’s the deal?

  1. #1

    Catholicism & Catholics - What’s the deal?

    That there had been and still is a Jewish problem no one can deny. Since the rejection of Israel, 1,900 years ago, the Jews have scattered in every direction, and in spite of the difficulties and even persecution, they have established themselves as a power in nearly every nation of Europe.

    In view of this Jewish problem, which affects the Catholic Church in a special way, we publish the following amazing extracts from a number of speeches recently made under the auspices of a Jewish society in Paris. The name of our informant must remain concealed. He is presently known to us, but by reason of his peculiar relations with the Jews at the present time, we have agreed not to disclose his identity nor to give away any further details of the Paris meeting beyond the following extracts which, though sometimes freely translated, nevertheless substantially convey the meaning of the original statements.--Editorial Note glories in the fact that without detriment to their own racial unity and international character, the Jews have been able to spread their doctrines and increase their political, social and economic influence among the nations..

    "As long as there remains among the Gentiles any moral conception of the social order, and until all faith, patriotism and dignity are uprooted, our reign over the world shall not come.

    "We have already fulfilled part of our work, but we cannot yet claim that the whole of our work is done. We have still a long way to go before we can overthrow our main opponent: the Catholic Church...

    "We must always bear in mind that the Catholic Church is the only institution which has stood, and which will, as long as it remains in existence, stand in our way. The Catholic Church, with her methodical work and her edifying and moral teachings, will always keep her children in such a state of mind, as to make them too self-respecting to yield to our domination, and to bow before our future King of Israel...

    "That is why we have been striving to discover the best way of shaking the Catholic Church to her very foundations. We have spread the spirit of revolt and false liberalism among the nations of the Gentiles so as to persuade them away from their faith and even to make them ashamed of professing the precepts of their Religion and obeying the Commandments of their Church. We have brought many of them to boast of being atheists, and more than that, to glory in being descendants of the ape! We have given them new theories, impossible of realization, such as Communism, Anarchism, and Socialism, which are now serving our purpose...The stupid Gentiles have accepted them with the greatest enthusiasm, without realizing that those theories are ours, and that they constitute our most powerful instrument against themselves...


    "We have blackened the Catholic Church with the most ignominious calumnies, we have stained her history and disgraced even her noblest activities. We have imputed to her the wrongs of her enemies, and thus brought these latter to stand more closely by our side... So much so, that we are now witnessing to our greatest satisfaction, rebellions against the Church in several countries... We have turned her clergy into objects of hatred and ridicule, we have subjected them to the contempt of the crowd... We have caused the practice of the Catholic religion to be considered out of date and a mere waste of time..
    "And the Gentiles, in their stupidity, have proved easier dupes than we expected them to be. One would expect more intelligence and more practical common sense, but they are no better than a herd of sheep. Let them graze in our fields till they become fat enough to be worthy of being immolated to our future King of the World...

    "We have founded many secret associations, which all work for our purpose, under our orders and our direction. We have made it an honour, a great honour, for the Gentiles to join us in our organizations, which are, thanks to our gold, flourishing now more than ever. Yet it remains our secret that those Gentiles who betray their own and most precious interests, by joining us in our plot should never know that these associations are of our creation and that they serve our purpose...

    "One of the many triumphs of our Freemasonry is that those Gentiles who become members of our Lodges, should never suspect that we are using them to build their own jails, upon whose terraces we shall erect the throne of our Universal King of Israel; and should never know that we are commanding them to forge the chains of their own servility to our future King of the world.


    "So far, we have considered our strategy in our attacks upon the Catholic Church from the outside. But this is not all. Let us now explain how we have gone further in our work, to hasten the ruin of the Catholic Church, and how we have penetrated into her most intimate circles, and brought even some of her Clergy to become pioneers of our cause.

    "Apart altogether from the influence of our philosophy, we have taken other steps to secure a breach in the Catholic Church. Let me explain how this has been done.

    "We have induced some of our children to join the Catholic body, with the explicit intimation that they should work in a still more efficient way for the disintegration of the Catholic Church, by creating scandals within her. We have thus followed the advice of our Prince of the Jews, who so wisely said: 'Let some of your children become canons, so that they may destroy the Church'. Unfortunately, not all among the 'convert' Jews have proved faithful to their mission. Many of them have even betrayed us! But, on the other hand, others have kept their promise and honored their word. Thus the counsel of our Elders has proved successful.


    "We are the Fathers of all Revolutions - even of those which sometimes happen to turn against us. We are the supreme Masters of Peace and War. We can boast of being the Creators of the REFORMATION! Calvin was one of our Children; he was of Jewish descent, and was entrusted by Jewish authority and encouraged with Jewish finance to draft his scheme in the Reformation.

    "Martin Luther yielded to the influence of his Jewish friends, and again, by Jewish authority and with Jewish finance, his plot against the Catholic Church met with success...

    "Thanks to our propaganda, to our theories of Liberalism and to our misrepresentations of Freedom, the minds of many among the Gentiles were ready to welcome the Reformation. They separated from the Church to fall into our snare. And thus the Catholic Church has been very sensibly weakened, and her authority over the Kings of the Gentiles has been reduced almost to naught..
    "We are grateful to Protestants for their loyalty to our wishes - although most of them are, in the sincerity of their faith, unaware of their loyalty to us. We are grateful to them for the wonderful help they are giving us in our fight against the stronghold of Christian Civilization, and in our preparations for the advent of our supremacy over the whole world and over the Kingdoms of the Gentiles.

    "So far we have succeeded in overthrowing most of the Thrones of Europe. The rest will follow in the near future. Russia has already worshiped our rule, France, with her Masonic Government, is under our thumb. England, in her dependence upon our finance is under our heel; and in her Protestantism is our hope for the destruction of the Catholic Church. Spain and Mexico are but toys in our hands. And many other countries, including the U.S.A., have already fallen before our scheming.


    "But the Catholic Church is still alive..
    "We must destroy her without the least delay and without the slightest mercy. Most of the Press in the world is under our Control; let us therefore encourage in a still more violent way the hatred of the world against the Catholic Church. Let us intensify our activities in poisoning the morality of the Gentiles. Let us spread the spirit of revolution in the minds of the people. They must be made to despise Patriotism and the love of their family, to consider their faith as a humbug, their obedience to their Church as a degrading servility, so that they may become deaf to the appeal of the Church and blind to her warnings against us. Let us, above all, make it impossible for Christians outside the Catholic Church to be reunited with that Church, or for non-Christians to join that Church; otherwise the greatest obstruction to our domination will be strengthened and all our work undone. Our plot will be unveiled, the Gentiles will turn against us, in the spirit of revenge, and our domination over them will never be realized.

    "Let us remember that as long as there still remain active enemies of the Catholic Church, we may hope to become Masters of the World... And let us remember always that the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before the Pope in Rome is dethroned, as well as all the other reigning monarchs of the Gentiles upon earth."


  2. #2

    Easter Sunday Message

    Father Manuel Musallam, the recently retired parish priest of the Holy Family Church in Gaza said at the height of Israel’s killing spree: “Our people in Gaza are treated like animals in a zoo. They eat but remain hungry; they cry, but no one wipes their tears. There is no water, no electricity, no food, only fear, terror and blockade… Our children are living in a state of trauma and fear. They are sick from it and for other reasons such as malnutrition, poverty and the cold… The hospitals did not have basic first aid before the war and now thousands of wounded and sick are pouring in and they are performing operations in the corridors. The situation is frightening and sad.” When he speaks about Jerusalem, he reminds us that it “was the city of God, peace and prayer, but it has been converted into a city of man, war and hatred. Instead of becoming the key to the doors of heaven, it has become the key to war and blood. . . Every stone built in the Apartheid Wall, every axe strike digging under the Al-Aqsa Mosque and every house destroyed by Israel will increase the intensity of resistance and resentfulness. . . Israel has devastated and tortured us in their many wars. We ask you to see the wounds of innocent Palestinian people and to be compassionate towards the Palestinian holocaust that you witness with your own eyes and touch with your own hands, and to know those who perpetrated this crime against our children. Search with us for justice that is the mother of peace. Protect us and safeguard our Holy Sites. . . May Christ’s compassion revive our love for God even though it is currently in ‘intensive care’.”

    Last edited by Archivist; 04-05-2010 at 02:34 PM.

  3. #3
    Señor Member Archivist's Avatar
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    Re: Easter Sunday Message

    Somebody posted Is Easter Christian? at Stormfront Theology.

    Let's see how long it lasts.

  4. #4

    U.S. Catholics debate defrocking abusive priests / Process can take years, raising qu

    U.S. Catholics debate defrocking abusive priests / Process can take years, raising questions about best approach - AP


  5. #5

    Abusive priests' personnel files remain under wraps - Los Angeles Times

    Abusive priests' personnel files remain under wraps - Los Angeles Times


  6. #6

    Shroud of Turin Reappears, Fortifying the Faith of Pilgrims - New York Times

    Shroud of Turin Reappears, Fortifying the Faith of Pilgrims - New York Times


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    Re: Catholicism & Catholics - What’s the deal?

    Peter and the Papacy: Was Peter First Pope, Holy Father, Supreme Pontiff, and Vicar of Christ?

    Was the Apostle Peter the first Pope, the earthly head of the church according to the Bible? Was he the Chief Shepherd, the Supreme Pontiff, and Vicar of Christ? Is the Roman Catholic church the true church as proved by a succession of the Papacy since Peter? Does the Bishop of Rome have authority to declare church law? Does the Bible teach that the Papacy is the foundation of the church? What about celibacy? Should we bow to honor the Pope as the Holy Father?


    Several religious groups teach as fundamental doctrine that Peter was the first earthly head and Chief Shepherd (pastor) of the church, and modern church leaders are his successors. Others claim that the Papacy is the foundation of the church. Consider this quotation:

    "The Pope ... is the bishop of Rome and the Vicar of Christ on earth. He is the visible head of the whole Catholic Church ... Who was the first Pope? St. Peter, who was made Pope by Jesus Christ Himself ... Did Peter's authority die with him? No, it was handed down to a man named Linus, and after he died, it was handed down to another, and so on, during the past 2000 years ... Does Jesus require us to follow the Pope in matters of religion? Yes, because obedience and loyalty to the Pope are among the chief requirements of the Lord's plan for unity in His church" (A Catechism for Adults, by William Cogan, 1975 ed., pp. 55,56).
    In this study we want to see what the Bible says about this doctrine. If it is true, as important as it is, we will surely find it in the Bible.
    We have no personal ill-will toward any, nor do we want to misrepresent anyone. But we do urge people to seek for truth with an open mind. "Put your own selves to the test, whether you are in the faith; prove yourselves" (2 Corinthians 13:5). To do this we must "study the Scriptures every day to see whether these things are so" (Acts 17:11). No one should fear to examine his beliefs according to the Bible.
    (Note: all Scripture quotations will be from the St. Joseph New Catholic Edition of the Holy Bible - Confraternity Edition. All other quotations are from officially recognized Roman Catholic sources.)


    Part I. Did Jesus Establish the Office of Pope?

    Obviously Peter could be Pope only if Jesus authorized the existence of that office. So let us consider what Jesus' word says.

    A. The Office & Qualifications of the Pope
    Are Nowhere Mentioned in the Scriptures.
    The Bible specifically names several offices in the church and describes the work and qualifications of those who hold that office.

    Office Named Qualifications Work
    Apostles Eph. 4:11; Matt. 10:2-4;
    Luke 6:13-16 Acts 1:21-26;
    2 Cor. 12:11,12 Eph. 3:3-5;
    Acts 10:39-41
    Elders or Bishops Phil. 1:1; Acts 14:23;
    Eph. 4:11 1 Tim. 3:1-7;
    Titus 1:5-9 Acts 20:28;
    1 Peter 5:1-3
    Deacons Phil. 1:1 1 Tim. 3:8-13 Acts 6:1-6

    The Bible contains several passages where the office of Pope ought to be mentioned, if it existed. Ephesians 4:11,12 and 1 Corinthians 12:28 list various officers and workers in the church, but the office of Pope is not mentioned. Why not?
    Paul wrote several letters to and from Rome, naming many people there (Rom. 16; Col. 4:7-14; 2 Tim. 4:9-22; Philem. 23,24). If Peter was Pope in Rome, surely Paul would have mentioned him. But Paul mentions neither Peter nor anyone else as being Pope.
    Who can imagine someone today writing official letters to or from the church in Rome, listing the officers of the Catholic Church, giving all this information about the work and qualifications of lesser officers, but never mentioning the Pope? If the office of Pope was established by Jesus, why does the New Testament fail to mention it?

    B. The Bible Says Jesus Is the Head of the Church.
    The Pope is believed to be the head of the church, but note:
    Ephesians 1:22,23 - Jesus is head over all things to the church (cf. Col. 1:18). What is there left for a Pope to be head of?
    Ephesians 5:22-24 - A husband is head of his wife as Jesus is head of the church. But for a wife to submit to two husbands is adultery (Rom. 7:2,3). So for the church to submit to two heads (Jesus and the Pope) would be spiritual adultery.
    Matthew 28:18-20 - Christ has all authority in heaven and on earth. He is the one lawgiver (James 4:12). To claim that the Pope may issue religious laws is to deny the unique power of Jesus.
    The Bible plainly states that Jesus is Head of the church. He is the one Lord in the one body (church). There cannot be two Lords any more than there could be two Gods (Eph. 4:4-6). Bishops (even from Rome) are forbidden to lord it over the flock (1 Peter 5:1-3).

    C. The Bible Says Jesus Is the Church's Foundation.
    "The primacy of St. Peter was ... an essential part of Christ's church, the rock on which it was built ... The House of God will always need its foundation" (The Question Box, Bertrand Conway, 1929 Edition, pp. 153,154).
    Hence, the authority of Popes is said to be the foundation of the Catholic Church. But the Bible says:

    God's church has a divine foundation.
    1 Corinthians 3:11 - There can be no foundation other than Jesus.
    1 Peter. 2:3-8 - Peter himself taught that Jesus is the chief cornerstone on which the church is built. [Cf. Acts 4:10-12.]
    Matthew 16:13-18 - This passage is often used to try to prove Peter is the foundation of the church (Catechism, p. 56; Question Box, p. 146). But the passages already studied prove that Jesus, not Peter or the Pope, is the foundation of the church. Matthew 16. actually confirms this truth.
    The context (v13,15,16) is not discussing who Peter is nor what his position is, but who Jesus is and what His position is. The passage does not exalt Peter; it exalts Jesus. Jesus does not confess Peter; Peter confesses Jesus.
    The verse is not saying Peter is the rock on which the church is built, but rather it contrasts Peter's name (Greek PETROS, masculine - a piece of rock) to the rock on which the church would be built (Greek PETRA, feminine - a solid ledge of rock).
    Jesus often compared Himself to inanimate objects - a temple (John 2:18-22), a door (John 10:7), a vine (John 15:1-11). Here He compares Himself to a rock, a name often used for Deity in the Old Testament (Psa. 31:3; 71:3; 89:26ff; 18:2f,32f).
    The foundation of the church is not Peter. It is the truth that Peter had just confessed - that Jesus is the Christ the Son of God (v16). This is confirmed by the context and by other Scriptures. To say Peter is the foundation would be to put a man in the place of Deity!

    The lives of Peter and of the Popes make them entirely unfit to be the foundation of Jesus' church.
    Consider some great sins in the life of Peter.
    * Immediately after talking about the foundation of the church, Christ rebuked Peter saying: "Get behind me, satan, thou art a scandal to me; for thou dost not mind the things of God, but those of men" (Matthew 16:21-23).
    * Peter denied Jesus 3 times, even with curses and swearing (Matthew 26:69-75).
    * Jesus rebuked Peter's lack of faith (Matthew 14:22-31).
    * Peter was hypocritical and disobeyed the gospel (Galatians 2:11ff).
    Now consider sins in the lives of Catholic Popes.
    The following facts have been gleaned from the Catholic Dictionary and the Catholic Encyclopedia (at
    * At least 4 Popes are admitted to have had illegitimate children.
    * At least 5 Popes were sons of priests, including at least one (maybe two) Popes who were sons of other Popes! (Some of these priests may have been married but left their families to become priests.)
    * At least 6 Popes were excommunicated or condemned as heretics, including one Pope who was excommunicated twice and two Popes who excommunicated one another!

    "In the first twelve centuries of her existence the Church was disturbed some twenty-five times by rival claimants of the Papacy. The strife thus originated was always an occasion of scandal, sometimes of violence and bloodshed ... For forty years (in the 14th century) two and even three pretenders to the Papacy claimed the allegiance of Catholics: whole countries, learned men and canonised saints, ranged themselves on different sides, and even now it is not perhaps absolutely certain who was Pope..." (Catholic Dictionary, Addis & Arnold, p. 869).
    Who can believe that Christ's church is founded on an office occupied by such men as these? Imagine Jesus' church supposedly going through long periods of time in which nobody really knows who was the real head of the church! How much better to accept the plain Bible teaching that the church is founded on the sinless, Divine Son of God!

    D. The Bible Says Jesus Is the Chief Shepherd.
    "The Vatican Council defines as an article of faith that ... Christ 'conferred upon Peter alone the jurisdiction of Chief Pastor [shepherd] and Ruler over all the flock'" (Question Box, p. 147).

    But the Bible repeatedly says Jesus is the Chief Shepherd.
    John 10:11,14 - Jesus is the Good Shepherd. We should not follow strangers (v1,5,8-13; cf. Ezek. 34:23; 37:24; Psa. 23).
    1 Peter 5:4 - Peter himself spoke of the Prince Shepherd (the footnote in the Catholic Bible says, "the Greek reads, 'the chief Shepherd'"). This Shepherd will come to reward the faithful, clearly referring to Jesus' second coming (2 Tim. 4:8; Apoc. 2:10; 22:12; Matt. 25:31-46; etc.)
    Hebrews 13:20 - Jesus is the Great Shepherd.
    The Catholic Bible says Jesus is the Chief or Great Shepherd, but the Catholic council declared, as an article of faith, that this position belongs to "Peter alone"!

    In John 21:15-17, Jesus told Peter to feed His sheep.
    Some say this proves Peter was the Chief Shepherd (Question Box, pp. 147,148; Catechism, p. 56).
    But all the apostles were told to feed the sheep in the sense of teaching them (Matt. 28:18-20; Mark 16:15,16) and caring for them (2 Cor. 11:28). Bishops were also told to feed the flock (1 Pet. 5:1-3; Acts 20:28). Are all these other people Popes too?
    Jesus' statement was not intended to exalt Peter to authority over the other apostles, but simply to restore him to the apostleship from which he had fallen. Peter had denied Jesus three times (John 18:15-18,25-27). So Jesus had him confess his love three times, and then restored him to the responsibility that all the apostles would share.
    There is no passage, here or elsewhere, which calls Peter the Chief Shepherd or which states He has authority over the other apostles.
    The basic error of the doctrine of Papal authority is that it exalts man to the place of God. God said that His Divine Son is head, foundation, and chief shepherd for the church. No mere man is ever given such positions. To exalt a man to these positions is blasphemous.


    Part II: Did Peter Act Like a Pope?

    Since there is no evidence that the office of Pope even existed in the early church, obviously neither Peter nor anyone else could hold the office. But let us confirm our conclusions by looking at the Bible teaching specifically about Peter to see if he acted like a Pope.

    A. Peter Had No Authority above Other Apostles.
    "The Catholic Church believes that St. Peter was the chief Apostle, exercising by Christ's appointment the supreme power of governing His church. The Vatican Council says: 'If anyone says that Christ the Lord did not constitute the Blessed Peter prince of all the Apostles and head of the whole church militant ... let him be anathema'" (Question Box, p. 145).
    But notice what God says:

    All apostles received direct guidance of the Holy Spirit - Acts 2:1-4; Ephesians 3:3-5; John 16:13; 14:26.
    Why would apostles need guidance from a Pope if they were guided directly by the Spirit? Paul expressly stated that his teaching was not based on anything learned from man but on direct revelation from Jesus - Galatians 1:11,12,16,17; 2:6-9,11-14.

    All apostles received the power to "bind and loose."
    Some claim that Jesus, in Matthew 16:19, gave exclusively to Peter the power to bind and loose, but Matthew 18:18 shows that others also had the same power.
    John 20:22,23 - All apostles had power to forgive or retain sins, but only as guided by the Holy Spirit. No apostle could originate laws but could only reveal the laws God made. They did this by revealing and preaching the gospel. If men obey, their sins are forgiven; if not, their sins are retained - Rom. 1:16; Mark 16:15,16; Acts 2:36-41; etc.
    The gospel was the "keys" or authority by which apostles opened the door for men to enter the church. Peter was the first to preach to Jews (Acts 2) and to Gentiles (Acts 10), but all apostles had authority to preach the gospel. No passage anywhere says the other apostles submitted to Peter's authority.

    Paul affirmed he was equal with other apostles in every way - 2 Corinthians 11:5; 12:11.
    All apostles were ambassadors for Christ (2 Corinthians 5:20). If Peter had authority over all apostles, Paul would have been behind him, but Paul denies this.
    There is no proof Peter had authority over other apostles, but much proof shows the others had all that Peter had.

    B. Peter Did Not Fit the Pattern of Modern Popes.
    Peter was a married man, but modern Popes are not permitted to marry.
    Matthew 8:14 - Jesus healed the mother of Peter's wife.
    1 Corinthians 9:5 - Peter (Cephas) continued to have a wife (woman) after the church began. The footnote in the St. Joseph New Catholic Edition of the Bible adds, "There is no question of a right to marry. The Apostles had that right...." This expressly included Peter.
    1 Peter 5:1-3 - Peter was an elder or bishop, and bishops were married (Titus 1:5,6; 1 Timothy 3:2). The footnote on 1 Tim. 3:2 in the St. Joseph New Catholic Edition says: "...priestly celibacy as a law is of later ecclesiastical institution." In other words, Peter and all first-century bishops had the right to be married. The law against such marriages was made by the Catholic church after the Bible was complete.
    Hebrews 13:4; 1 Timothy 4:1-3 - Marriage is honorable for all people. That includes apostles and all church officials. To teach that certain people may not marry is a doctrine of apostasy.
    The Catholic doctrine of celibacy would eliminate from serving as Pope the very man they say was the first Pope! The doctrine of celibacy is expressly stated in the Scriptures to be heresy.

    Peter refused to allow men to bow to honor him religiously, but modern Popes accept and encourage this.
    Acts 10:25,26 - Peter forbade Cornelius to worship him or to bow before him. Peter's reason was that he was a man. Are not modern Popes men too? Why should modern Popes accept that which Peter refused?
    The Bible never allows anyone to bow to any man as an act of honor for his religious office (Matt. 4:10; Apoc. 22:8,9). Yet modern Popes allow and expect this.

    Peter was never addressed by titles of exaltation such as are used to honor modern Popes.
    Peter is never called "Pope," "Chief Pastor," "Prince of the Apostles," "Head of the Church," "Ruler of the Church," "Supreme Pontiff," etc. He was called simply an apostle and servant (1 Peter 1:1; 2 Peter 1:1) and fellow-presbyter (1 Peter 5:1).
    Some argue that Peter avoided these titles because he was humble and modest. But if he was the first Pope, why don't modern Popes imitate his humility and modesty?! The fact is that Peter refused such titles because Jesus forbade it.
    Matthew 23:9 expressly forbids calling any man "father" as a title of religious honor. Yet the word "Pope" originally meant "Father" (Catholic Dictionary, p. 667). Modern popes and priests wear the very title that Jesus forbade!
    Clearly, if the apostle Peter were alive today, he would never be accepted as Pope. Yet Catholics claim he was their very first Pope!

    C. There Is No Valid Scriptural Proof that Peter Ever Acted as Pope.
    Those who claim Peter was Pope are responsible to prove their claim is valid. We have already examined their use of Matt. 16:18 and John 21:15ff. Now consider some other passages they cite:

    Luke 22:31,32 - Jesus prayed for Peter so he could strengthen his brethren.
    Some actually claim this proves Peter was Pope (Question Box, p. 147). But other people besides Peter strengthened or confirmed brethren (Acts 18:23; 14:21f; 15:32,41). Were these people all Popes too?
    Jesus prayed for other apostles and disciples besides Peter (John 17:9,11,15,20). Did that make them all Popes?
    The next verses in Luke 22 (v33,34) show that Jesus did not pray for Peter to exalt him as Pope, but for just the opposite reason. Jesus knew Peter was about to deny Him!

    Peter took the lead in many events in Acts.
    This includes the choosing of Matthias (Acts 1:15-26), preaching on Pentecost (Acts 2), healing a lame man (Acts 3,4), the death of Ananias & Sapphira (Acts 5), preaching to the first Gentiles (Acts 10), etc. Some claim this proves he was Pope (Question Box, p. 148).
    But Paul was at least as dominant in Acts 13-28 as Peter was in Acts 1-12. Was Paul Pope too?
    Peter was truly an important man, just as Paul was. In all groups some people are more outspoken than others, and this was surely Peter's case. But none of these passages say or imply he was Pope or head of the church. The fact a man is able to speak well does not prove he has authority over others.

    It is claimed Peter presided over the Jerusalem meeting about circumcision (Acts 15).
    It is claimed that he spoke first and he settled the issue (Question Box, pp. 148, 152).
    However, Paul and Barnabas were sent to the meeting to speak to the apostles and presbyters (v2) - no distinctions were made among the apostles. If Peter was the head, why doesn't it say they went to confer with "the Pope, the apostles, and the presbyters"?
    Peter did not speak first. There had been long debate before he spoke (v7). And his speech did not settle the issue. People kept silent after he spoke only so they could listen to other speakers (v12)! The final course of action was suggested by James (v13,19ff). And the whole procedure was directed by the Holy Spirit (v28), which led all apostles as we have already shown.

    It is claimed that, in lists of apostles, Peter is named first because he was Pope (Question Box, p. 148).
    But in the following lists, he is not named first: Gal. 2:9; 1 Cor. 1:12; 3:22; John 1:44. Does this prove the people listed before Peter had authority over him? Being first in a list does not prove one is a Pope.
    The lists where Peter is named first clearly state the office to which he was appointed - like other men, he was chosen to be an apostle (Luke 6:13-16; Matt. 10:2ff). If Peter was chosen to the office of Pope, why is this never stated anywhere?

    It is claimed that Jesus gave Peter a special name because he would be Pope (Question Box, p. 148).
    But Jesus gave a special name to James and John (Mark 3:16,17). And God gave special names to Abraham and Sarah (Gen. 17:5,15), Jacob (Gen. 32:28f), and others. Were all these people Popes too?
    Be honest now. Isn't this weak and flimsy evidence on which to base such a major doctrine? The Bible clearly identifies the work and position in the church of Jesus, apostles, bishops, etc. If the office of Pope is really the foundation of the church, why don't we have clear Scriptural evidence for it?

    D. A Better Case Could Be Made to Prove Paul Was Pope.
    Both we and Catholics deny that Paul was ever a Pope, but if we used the kind of reasoning that is used to "prove" Peter to be Pope, we could make a better case that Paul was Pope.
    * Paul was not married (1 Corinthians 7).
    * Acts talks about Paul more than about Peter.
    * Paul rebuked Peter (Galatians 2:11-14); nowhere in Scripture did Peter rebuke Paul.
    * Paul cared for all the churches (2 Corinthians 11:28).
    * Paul was not behind any apostle (2 Corinthians 11:5; 12:11). Peter never made such a claim for himself.
    * Paul wrote 3/4 of the New Testament books. Peter wrote only 2 little ones.
    * Peter cited Paul's letters as authority (2 Peter 3:15,16), but Paul never cited Peter's letters as authority.
    * Scripture expressly tells us Paul was in Rome, but never says Peter was there.
    * Paul's labors exceeded those of other apostles (2 Corinthians 11:23).
    Now if, despite all these facts, we properly conclude that Paul was not a Pope, then surely we can see that the evidence offered for Peter as Pope is equally unconvincing.


    Part III: Are Modern Popes Successors of Peter?

    The Catholic Church tries to prove it is the true church by tracing a succession of Popes back to Peter. It is claimed that Peter was the chief apostle and that Popes are his successors as head of the church. However, we have shown that Jesus' church had no office of Pope, nor did Peter serve as Pope. Further, we have quoted Catholic books that admit there were times when no one knows who was Pope, so how can they know the succession? There can be no valid succession of Popes.
    But let us confirm this conclusion by considering other Bible teaching specifically regarding the issue of succession. Note that God warns about false apostles (2 Corinthians 11:13-15; Apoc. 2:2). Are modern Popes true apostles or false apostles?

    A. No Men Today Can Be Successors of Apostles.
    There is no Scriptural proof that the powers of apostles were handed down.
    Surely such a major doctrine must be taught in the Bible, but where is it? Those who believe it must prove it, but they cannot.
    Question Box defends the doctrine on pp. 153-156. But the only proof given is a statement from the Vatican Council, followed by three pages of quotations from uninspired men. There is not one reference to any Bible passage! Why not? Because the doctrine is not in the Bible.
    Apostles had to be eyewitnesses of the resurrected Christ.
    Peter and all apostles were eyewitnesses (Acts 2:32; 3:15; 4:33; 5:32; 10:39-41; 1 Cor. 15:4-8).
    Acts 1:21,22 - The replacement of Judas is the only Bible case in which an apostle was replaced. The replacement had to be an eyewitness.
    Paul was an eyewitness (1 Corinthians 9:1; 15:8; Acts 22:14,15; 26:16). He was a witness "last of all" and "out of due time" (Jesus' appeared to him exceptionally late).
    Serving as an eyewitness was part of the calling of an apostle. Have all Popes seen Christ? If they have, then Paul was not last of all and was not exceptional. But if Popes have not seen Christ, then they do not have the qualifications required to succeed the apostles!
    Apostles did miracles to confirm their apostleship.
    Peter and other apostles raised the dead and instantly, totally healed all kinds of diseases (Acts 3:1-10; 9:32-42; 5:12-16; 13:6-12).
    2 Corinthians 12:12 - These were the "signs of an apostle." Their miracles proved they were from God (Mark 16:20; Acts 14:3; Hebrews 2:3,4; John 4:48; etc.). Do modern Popes do these signs? If not, why accept them as successors of Peter?
    Apostles could impart miraculous powers to others.
    Acts 8:14-19; 19:1-7; Romans 1:8-11 - Peter and other apostles bestowed miraculous gifts by laying their hands on others. This is the only sense in which apostles passed power on to others. But those who received gifts in this way (such as Philip) did not become apostles and could not, in turn, pass the power on to others. Only Paul and the original apostles had this power (Acts 8:5-18).
    Hence, apostles could impart spiritual gifts, but they had no successors who could do likewise, and nothing else about their position was imparted to others. Apostles lived on earth only one generation!
    Do modern Popes impart miraculous powers to others? If not, how could they become successors of Peter or the apostles, and how could they make other people successors?
    Apostles taught by direct guidance of the Spirit.
    Peter and other apostles had this power (Matthew 10:19,20; John 16:13; Ephesians 3:3-5; 1 Corinthians 14:37).
    Jude 3 - By this power they delivered the true faith to God's people once. It was not to be repeatedly delivered, just as Christ was not to be repeatedly sacrificed (cf. Heb. 9:26,28; 10:10; 7:26,27; 1 Pet. 3:18). All truth was delivered in the first century and recorded in the Scriptures (John 16:13; 2 Peter 1:3; Acts 20:20,27; 2 Tim. 3:16,17).
    When the delivery of the truth was complete ("perfect"), the gifts of direct revelation ceased - 1 Corinthians 13:8-13 (cf. James 1:25). No one today is directly guided by the Holy Spirit as apostles were, hence no one can be a true successor of the apostles.

    The Catholic Church admits that Popes do not have these qualifications.
    Though the Catholic church claims that Popes are successors of Peter and the apostles, yet they openly admit the following:

    "Peter, it is true, ... possessed also the gift of inspiration and the power of working miracles. These two latter gifts are not claimed by the Pope ... The Apostles were endowed with the gift of inspiration ... No Catholic, on the contrary, claims that the Pope is inspired or endowed with Divine revelation properly so called" (Faith of Our Fathers, pp. 89,99).
    It is argued that these powers are not essential to the office of Pope. But read again the passages cited above and you will see that these powers were essential to the office of apostles. If Popes do not have these powers, how can they be successors of the apostles?
    Modern Popes cannot be successors of apostles because they are not eyewitnesses of Christ, they do not possess miraculous powers, they cannot impart such powers to others, and they are not directly guided by the Spirit. They possess none of the unique qualifications of apostles!
    How then does a man become Pope today? He is chosen by a body of men called Cardinals. Yet the Catholic Dictionary admits: "For a long time there was no such thing as a cardinal bishop..." It claims the first such men were named in 304 AD. Finally, a council in 1059 AD "decreed that Popes should henceforth be elected on the judgment of the six cardinal bishops..." (p. 118).
    The Catholic Church claims that the succession of Popes is a chain that connects the modern church to the first-century church. But Popes were unknown in the Bible, Peter was not a Pope, modern Popes have none of the essential qualifications of the apostles they are supposed to succeed, and it is admitted that there are times at which no one knows who was Pope. Furthermore, the men who select the Pope were unknown in the Bible and in history for centuries after the church began. And the modern means of selecting Popes was not determined until a millennium after the church began! The whole "chain" is missing! And this is the evidence used to prove that the Catholic Church is the true church!

    B. Successors to Apostles Are Not Needed Today.
    The duties of apostles were accomplished for all time by the original apostles. The work of apostles does not need to continue on earth.
    The apostles wrote what the Spirit revealed to them (1 Cor. 14:37; Eph. 3:3-5; 2 Pet. 3:15,16; etc.).
    These writings completely reveal all good works, everything we need to know to please God (2 Tim. 3:16,17; 2 Peter 1:3; John 16:13; Acts 20:20,27).
    The miracles of the first century, recorded in the Bible, confirm that the message was from God (John 20:30,31; 1 Cor. 15:4-8; note John 8:17,18; Matt. 18:16).
    The Scriptures can be understood by all who study diligently with an open mind (2 Tim. 3:16,17; Mark 7:14; Acts 17:11; 1 Cor. 14:33; Eph. 3:3-5).
    God now preserves the Scriptures for all generations (1 Peter 1:22-25; 2 John 2; 2 Peter 1:12-15; 3:1).
    People displease God when they follow teachings that differ from the gospel (Gal. 1:8,9; 2 John 9-11).
    The apostles' work on earth was completed in the first century and was recorded in the Bible, just like the work of Jesus was. We do not need successors to the apostles living on earth today for the same reasons that we do not need successors to Jesus living on earth today. The work of the apostles is now accomplished by the Scriptures they wrote.

    C. The True Church Cannot Be Identified by Tracing
    a Succession of Bishops.
    We have seen that the Catholic succession is a "chain" which is missing essentially all its links. Consider also the following points:

    The Bible warns of the danger of apostasy.
    2 Timothy 4:2-4 - People would turn away from truth and would turn aside to fables.
    1 Timothy 4:1-3 - They would depart from the faith and would require people to abstain from marriage and from certain kinds of foods. Catholicism has practiced both of these false doctrines.
    Acts 20:28-30 - Bishops would teach error and lead people astray (Matt. 15:14; 7:15-23; Gal. 1:6-10; 2 John 9-11).
    Note: If the bishops went into error, tracing a succession of them would not identify the true church! Yet in this study, we have identified several major points on which the Catholic hierarchy teaches error.

    The true church can be identified by comparing it to the Bible.
    God has preserved the gospel as the seed by which the church is reproduced (1 Peter 1:22-25; Luke 8:11). This seed produces today just what it did in the first century (Galatians 6:7). People who obey it are born again into God's true family, the church (Acts 2:38,47; Galatians 3:26,27; Romans 1:16).
    But when people persist in following doctrines different from the gospel, they go into apostasy. To determine whether a religious group is the true church of Christ, we must compare its doctrine and practice to the New Testament (Acts 17:11; Matthew 7:15- 23; Galatians 1:8,9; 2 John 9-11). If it has gone into apostasy, it cannot be Jesus' church.

    We seek to help, not hurt, all who read this material. We urge you to study the Scriptures for yourself to see if these things are so (Acts 17:11). If you find you have been in error, please contact those who gave you this booklet. They will gladly help you find Jesus' true church.

  8. #8

    Pope blames church's sins for scandal

    Pope blames church's sins for scandal
    By Nicole Winfield ASSOCIATED PRESS

    LISBON (AP) -- Pope Benedict XVI on Tuesday blamed the church's own sins for the clerical abuse scandal -- not a campaign mounted by outsiders -- and called for profound purification to end what he called the "greatest persecution" the church has endured.

    His strong comments placed the blame for the crisis squarely on the sins of pedophile priests, repudiating the Vatican's initial response to the scandal, in which it blamed the media as well as pro-choice and pro-gay marriage advocates for mounting a campaign against the church and the pope.

    Speaking en route to Portugal, Benedict said the Catholic Church always has suffered from problems of its own making but "today we see it in a truly terrifying way."

    "The greatest persecution of the church doesn't come from enemies on the outside but is born from the sins within the church," the pontiff said. "The church needs to profoundly relearn penitence, accept purification, learn forgiveness but also justice."

    Benedict was responding to journalists' questions, submitted in advance, aboard the papal plane as he flew to Portugal. His four-day visit will take him from Lisbon to the famed Fatima shrine to Portugal's second city, Porto.

    It is not known whether Benedict would make further remarks about the scandal during the trip, but there have been no reported cases of sex abuse in Portugal, unlike in Malta, where Benedict met with abuse victims on a trip there last month.

    Despite the Vatican's initial defensive response to hundreds of clerical abuse reports in Europe, Benedict has called for penance and promised that the church would take action to protect children and make abusive priests face justice.

    As far as the church's purification is concerned, Benedict already has started cleaning house, accepting the resignations of a few bishops in recent weeks who either admitted they molested youngsters or covered up for priests who did.

    Just last week, the pope took control of the conservative Legionaries of Christ order after it was discredited by revelations that its founder fathered at least one child and sexually abused young seminarians.

    More resignations have been tendered by bishops, and the Vatican official in charge of handling sex abuse cases has said he would not be surprised if the pope asks for other resignations.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Alpha_and_Omega's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Jew Bedford, Massajewsetts

    Re: Easter Sunday Message

    Quote Originally Posted by Archivist View Post
    Somebody posted Is Easter Christian? at Stormfront Theology.

    Let's see how long it lasts.
    That was me that posted that. I'm Lusitanian Len at

    Speaking of the theology section there, that reminds me that I need to re-post the letter or article by David Tate, a member of The Order, where he speaks of the non-CI element within the movement falsely claiming that The Order was not made up of a majority or ANY CI members. I posted it twice in the "Newslinks & Articles" section of only to have it removed both times.

    After it was removed the second time I received a PM from moderator Lycia saying that if I had to post it I should do it in the Theology section. Well, I wasn't yet a member of the Theology section and never quite knew how to become one so I sent her a reply message asking how to go about it, which she replied back to and let me know.

  10. #10

    Re: Easter Sunday Message

    That there had been and still is a Jewish problem no one can deny. Since the rejection of Israel, 1,900 years ago, the Jews have scattered in every direction, and in spite of the difficulties and even persecution, they have established themselves as a power in nearly every nation of Europe.
    Yeah ... the Jews have established themselves all across Europe and the world including the Vatican:
    If this isn't a Jew then nobody is.

    By the way ... don't get today's Jews confused with biblical Israel. They are distinctly different from one another in almost every way.

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